Did We Choose God or Did God Choose Us? - Steve Henry

1 (2s): Good morning harvest church. When you stand, as we worship the Lord this morning, we worship the God who was, we worship the God who is we worship the God who ever more will. 1 (42s): He opened the present doors. He parted the God, pulls the victim victory, and we sing the God who heals. 1 (1m 29s): We sing to the God. We sing the God who that 0 (2m 1s): In the 1 (2m 10s): Shout we were the, we wear the P there, joy in the house of the Lord. 1 (3m 5s): There's joy in the house of the Lord today. And we won't be quiet. We shout outta your joy in the house of the Lord. Got it. Won't be we shout outta 0 (3m 23s): Your enjoy 1 (3m 26s): Lord. 0 (3m 27s): Enjoy the 1 (3m 31s): Won't. 1 (4m 19s): God, you are all powerful. We to your name this morning, there's the I've seen its battles right in there's that I've seen his praise. 1 (5m 10s): And that's the power of your name. Just mention makes a wave giants falling strongholds break. There is healing. That's the power that I claim. It's the same, the grave. There's no power. Like the there's a hope that calls our courage in the furnace. 1 (6m 13s): The kind expectations that every prayer I made is on an empty that's the power of that's that's 0 (7m 2s): There's 1 (7m 2s): No pav. Come on church, sing this out. I see you taking ground. I see you. Pressa head you. Power is danger to the enemies camp. You still do miracles. You will do what you said for your the same God. Now, as you've always been spirit, spirit breaking out your kingdom, moving in your big tree, claims the ground at the enemy had you still do miracles. 1 (7m 53s): You do what you for that's it's the same. 0 (8m 21s): There's 1 (8m 36s): Like, 2 (8m 47s): God, we're so grateful Lord for your power Lord. As we ponder the power of the living, God, I, I pray God that we would ponder what that means in our lives, in our relationships Lord, and especially heavy on my heart today or marriages, Lord. So as we take a kind of a Salo moment and just pause, Lord, help us to grab, grab hold of that power for our marriages and for the marriages of those, the people in our lives, Lord God that we love and care for. 2 (9m 37s): So deeply Lord, as we take a moment of pause and I'm gonna stop talking is as you feel led, if you feel like man, God's given you something to pray for a verse word of encouragement, go ahead and speak up loudly so we can hear and agree with you. And we'll just take a moment just as you feel led just as you feel LA 3 (10m 25s): Father, I thank you for your power. I thank you Lord, for your strength and for the strength that you give us father, I thank you father for the relationships in a marriage Lord that you bonded and that you've set forth to be a family father. I thank you, God, that you give us wisdom through your power, that you give us strength through your power and that God that no enemy can stand against us. Father. I just thank you, Lord, that God, in this place, that father, the freedom for you to come to this place and to freely speak Lord and to freely father lead us and guide us. 3 (11m 15s): I thank you, Lord, that God that you open the windows of heaven, that you pour out your spirit on those in this place, that God that you teaches the truth of your word and that father, you give us hope where there is no hope and you give us help. Father. When we feel helpless and father, I just praise your name, that God that we come here to worship you and that we're allowed to do that. And that God that without you, we have nothing, Lord, there's nothing. This world has to offer God without you. So I just praise your name and I worship you. 3 (11m 58s): And I thank you on this day, Jesus and Jesus name. 4 (12m 9s): And I thank you Lord for marriage father. I just pray that we would not look to our spouses as God's father, that we would look to you. We would not expect them to be perfect, that we would not expect them to be anything except for what would happen to. We ask fathers that we see them just as we see ourselves as flawed beings so that everything they bring to the table would be a blessing father because our whole dependents will be upon you and not upon men. And we thank you for our father. We pray for your holy spirit that you deny us strengthen us us because we know that father in the breaking down of the marriage comes to breaking down the country. 4 (12m 56s): We see that happening all over. So I asked father, did your help us stand strong? And I thank you for so to 3 (13m 4s): Thank pray for strength for S for healing, the grace would be extended. God. There would just be 2 (13m 18s): Exceeding health and kindness and grace for one another. Lord, God that we would live together in harmony as husbands and wives, Lord God extending wonderful kindness and grace, God, we're not being kind. Lord. I, I pray that you would challenge us and give us the grace to be kind. When we want to do something different, we want to lash out. We want to say something that will only further harm Lord God. So give us the grace to love unconditionally supernaturally. So everything that you ask us to do in this life requires a supernatural power of the holy spirit, the, the word and the will of God through us to do what you've asked us to do. 2 (14m 6s): So I pray God that we would have greater capacity to believe greater ability to understand what that looks like and how to walk it out. And then just greater fruitfulness as a result of just allowing that to flow and intentionally just moving forward with that grace and power, doing the stuff that you've called us to do. Thank you, Lord. Thank you, Lord. Thank you, Lord. We're gonna sing another song. And for those tuning in online and watching this service, we know that there's a bit of silence on your end and I would just encourage you to take that silent opportunity just to worship and just to be present with the Lord. 2 (14m 52s): I would encourage you not to be put off by that or be distracted by the silence, but just to be present with the Lord during that time, and for us who are gathered, we can't always hear what's being prayed or said or communicated and that's okay. The people around those who are speaking, they hear it. And so we just need to be patient with that process and okay, with that process that God's doing stuff. And even if we can't fully hear by God's grace, we can just be in a worship full place and agree and just see what the Lord will do as we just humbly wait during this time. So we're gonna be doing this Sundays and as part of an act, our active worship toward the Lord. 2 (15m 39s): And so I'm going to step down now we're gonna sing another song and then we'll, we'll keep moving forward. Amen. Let's let's continue to worship 1 (16m 15s): Who's I know that you one who to the, for I got, I need you. 1 (16m 58s): Oh God, my God. I need you now. How I need you now I know with you all things are awesome. 1 (17m 48s): I'm calling on the God. David who made courage. Oh God, my God. 0 (18m 10s): I need you. 1 (18m 11s): Oh God, my God. 0 (18m 13s): I need you 1 (18m 15s): Now. I need you now on standing. Oh, you heard your children and you hear your children. 1 (19m 20s): Now you are the same God, you are the same. God, you answered prayers back then will answer. Now you are the same God, you are the same God you are providing that. You are providing. Now you are the same. God, you move in power. Then God move in power. Now you are the same God, you are the God you 0 (20m 8s): A healer. 1 (20m 10s): You 0 (20m 11s): Are a, 1 (20m 13s): Now you're the same. 0 (20m 16s): God, 1 (20m 17s): You're the same. 0 (20m 19s): God 1 (20m 20s): You savior that. You're the, 0 (20m 31s): The the God, 1 (20m 34s): Oh God, my God 0 (20m 35s): Need 1 (20m 36s): You. Oh God, my God, I need you now need you rock, rock standing. Oh God, I 0 (22m 20s): You're 1 (22m 20s): Afraid the is. Then you are freeing heart trying. Now you are the same. You touch the, then I feel your touch right now. You are the same. You the same calling on the holy spirit. 1 (23m 21s): Almight here ever come. Yeah. 5 (23m 49s): Today, Phyllis, this morning, we just asked that your, your holy spirit would fill this place. Lord, we're here for you. We're in awe of your goodness this morning, God, we just asked that your will would be done in this place. We, we lift up our hearts to you. We offer our hearts to you. We ask that whatever you wanna do in and through our lives, whatever you wanna do in our hearts, whatever you wanna do in our minds, Lord, we, we just give ourselves to you completely, fully, totally Jesus. Because that's the only way we can experience freedom through you is just giving ourselves totally to you. So Lord, we relinquish our rights to our minds, our bodies, our souls, our hearts. 5 (24m 31s): And we just give it to you. Lord, we just ask that you would do your work through us. You'd work in us in Jesus name. Amen. Amen. Alright, you're welcome to take a seat. If you'd like my name's Curtis. It's great to have you all here this morning. First, before I get into announcements. I just wanna say that it's Tim Tim's birthday here. Yeah. It's Tim's our tech director here playing base today. No, no, he's not 17. He's no, it's a bit older than that. Anyway. I won't divulge how old he is anyway, but yeah, he's doing amazing things to the tech and obviously you can, he's scheduling all of our team members and stuff and doing a great job. 5 (25m 18s): So thank you Tim. Doing amazing. So yes, also. So we've got some life group signups happening next week. So stay tuned for that. We've got some amazing life groups coming up. If you want to get connected into the church, if you're new here or if you just don't know very many people, please join a life group next week. We'll we'll have a life group flyer available for you. You can look through 'em and pick the best one for you. We're just, we offer these so that you can get connected. And so that you don't feel like you're on the outside and oftentimes it can be easy to just be a spectator at church. We want you to be involved. 5 (25m 59s): We want you to get to know people. All right. Sound good. All right. So sign up next week for those also we've got a new college group starting up, so it's great because we've had kind of a gap between high school and then young professionals. And so now we've got a college group for you. If you're, if you're in the college age, feel free to join. That starts beginning of September. So if you want more information, you can head back to the info center with that. And if this is your first time here, or if you're newer as well, we would love to just get to know you. And so if you'd like head back to the info center and get a communication card, we'd just like to get to know you a little bit better and figure out a way to connect with you and make this church feel a little bit smaller, more connected. 5 (26m 46s): So do that. That'd be great. Thank you also, we've got a minute mingle coming up, but first we've got a baptism or a, a video recap of last week's beach bonfire, baptism barbecue. And it was incredible. We had 17 people baptized and so cast your eyes on the screen, check it out, 0 (27m 21s): Warm to praise. Praise. 5 (28m 44s): All right. Yeah. So it was an awesome time. If you want to get baptized, please head back to the info center and let us know. We'd love to have you get baptized. So now we're gonna get up and mingle with one another. Get to know somebody you don't know, and we'll be back in just a minute. So thanks. 7 (30m 42s): I love is 0 (30m 45s): Why 7 (30m 47s): Sing. 0 (30m 52s): I'll sing. 2 (30m 55s): Alrighty, come on back. Sing. We're gonna be in first, Peter, just for the first couple verses today and come on back Lord, as we get ready to open up your word, we thank you, God, that your word speaks to us now, as it has over this over the, the millennial Lord, God, you have just, you continue. You continue to speak to us and reveal truth to us. And so God, we invite you to do that today. We invite your will to be done. Thank you Lord. For your grace. We love you in Jesus name. 2 (31m 36s): Amen. Well, something weird was happening to me when I was sitting over there. I got like this weird equilibrium thing going on. Is that the right word? Equi. Lack of equal. You've been through that. Yeah. So pray Jan, why don't you pray for me? This is pastor jam. By the way, guys, I'm gonna let Jan pray for me here. I just feel like something's Amis here. Breathe. Ready? 3 (32m 7s): God. We pray for our pastor. Yes. 2 (32m 10s): You've given him 8 (32m 11s): A word for the day and you've opened up your scriptures to him and he stands here. Ready to speak for you and speak for the congregation and help your holy spirit. Roll down on holiness road down and worship. Roll down today. Thank 2 (32m 32s): You. 8 (32m 33s): So bring holy spirit power. Holy spirit power in this man. Thank you. And clear up his ears. Yes, Lord. Give his ears heal. Whatever is giving him this sense of being off, knowing that you are on. Yeah, that's right. And you were here and you were here before we asked you to show up. And Lord, we just asked that you would be with our pastor here. Thank you, Lord. Let him be to us. Matthew and mark and Luke and John and KFO. Rocky. Peter. Yeah. Yeah. Let him be for us your word today. 8 (33m 14s): Thank you 2 (33m 15s): Lord. 8 (33m 16s): So Lord bless him. Hold him close in your hand. Thank you, Lord. Give him the wisdom and knowledge that deep pool that Proverbs tells us runs deep. He's been storing up your word in his heart and there's no lack of faith here. Thank 2 (33m 31s): You, Lord. 8 (33m 31s): There's overwhelming openness to your spirit. So healing and strength for the day. Yes, Lord your grace sufficient for every need and pray in Jesus name. Jesus name. Holy spirit come. Thank you, Lord. Amen. 3 (33m 47s): Thank brother chair. 2 (34m 2s): So pastor Jan has been a pastor for decades and decades and decades. He was at the Grover beach Presbyterian church for a long time while I was an associate pastor at crossroads. And then when we planted this church and he resigned in 2008 to do other stuff and to take care of his wife. And so thank you Jan, for praying for me. Appreciate you brother. Thank you very much. So good to see you here today. So very good. Hey, first Peter chapter one, greetings from Peter, as we said last week, Peter is this, you know, the guy who was kind of gruff and tough and always putting his foot in his mouth, always kind of out of step, just a little bit with God's plans until until God really got a hold of him and filled him with this spirit and then wonderful and supernatural things began to take place in Peter's life. 2 (34m 51s): And part of which we see in early in acts, where he preaches and the multitudes come to faith in Jesus. And then we see Peter following Jesus decade after decade after decade, trusting him believing the gospel message and ultimately giving his life for it. As we mentioned last week, crucified, upside down, giving himself to the kingdom because he, he believed it through and through. There was nothing that was going to rattle his faith early on his faith was rattled a bit, but there was something that God did in him. And maybe that's something that God needs to do in us. Maybe you're in a place where it doesn't take much for your faith to be rattled and you need, you need God to do something deeper and more significant and supernatural in your lives. 2 (35m 38s): If you need God to do that, just invite the holy spirit into your life, to do that work and to work, make that work of sanctification real, that work of holiness real in your life. And so we're reading first, Peter today, a man who had waffled a man who was kind of gruff and stuck his foot in his mouth and did things he regretted at times. But then God, but God, and that's, isn't that just the beauty of knowing God we can say with Peter, but God, he rescued me. He sanctified me. He filled me with his power and his grace to do the work that he's called me to do. 2 (36m 20s): He's given me the ability to bounce back and God wants to do that with you as well. If you've struggled, give God the grace allow God's grace to just fill you and wash over you so that you too can bounce back. This letters from Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ called by Jesus. Jesus said to Peter, come follow me. And I will make you fishers of man. I'm writing to God's chosen people who are living as foreigners in the province of poncho Galatia, captia Asia. And Bethia again, these are Roman provinces located in what now is called Turkey. 2 (37m 2s): It's a place called Turkey. And we have a, a missionary in Azure by Jean, which is near Turkey. And we pray for him. And we talked about him last week and I encourage us to continue to pray for Igar in that work in by John. He is working to seek and to save those who are lost, but not just to seek and to save those who are lost, but to equip and release workers into the harvest field so that people might come to faith in Jesus. So I just love it that God has had his focus on that region, that part of the world for thousands of years now, Peter wrote this and now down through this, century's got us still working in that region. 2 (37m 43s): So God is so patient. And if you think God's been patient with you in your life, he, well he has, but this is just his nature and who he is, he's patient with us. So that more would come to faith in him, but also so that we would be sanctified set apart for his kingdom work. It's it, it's a process, a lifelong process that got us faithful and patient to accomplish in our lives. So this is who Peter's writing to verse two, it says, God, the father knew you and shows you long ago as his spirit has made you holy as a result, you have obeyed him and have been claims by the blood of Jesus Christ. May God give you more and more grace and peace and peace. 2 (38m 26s): So who is Peter writing to verse? One says I'm writing to God's chosen people. And we touched on this last week that we wanted to get through the whole message last week, but we weren't able to with everything else, everything else that was going on, good stuff. But we, we get back to it and we're gonna get through the whole thing this week, who is Peter writing to he's writing to God's chosen people, your Bible might say to God's elect. And again, who are the elect of God? The elect of God are those who have been chosen, right? So if we participate in an election, we make a choice. We cast our ballot for a person that we long to see elected. 2 (39m 6s): We choose that person. That's essentially what the election of God means that it means chosen. And by God to abstain salvation through Christ, Christians are called the chosen or the elect of God. And so it brings us to this question, did we choose God? Or did God choose us? Did we choose God? Or did God choose us? We tend to think in Greek ways of thinking, as opposed to a kind of a Hebrew thought, we have this kind of linear process for understanding truth. And we're, we tend to be a little more black and white. We want black and white answers for the theological questions that we have really for all of the questions that we have in life and Jeremy, our youth and family pastor gave me this book recently, it's called the forgotten Jesus, how Western Christians should follow and Eastern rabbi. 2 (39m 60s): And so there's a great portion of script writing in here and I'll just read it to us. It says, and again, this is kind of contrasting Hebrew mindset, Hebrew thinking versus Greek mindset and Greek thinking. They Hebrews and Greeks think about things all together differently. And so as we get a taste or a glimpse into a Hebrew way of thinking, we begin to understand scripture with greater clarity. We have better understanding about the culture in which this truth was communicated and preached and taught and understood. It says here in page 28, the ability to hold multiple options, intention may be why many Western readers of the Bible struggle with paradoxical concepts. 2 (40m 49s): We long to have a single answer to a question or a problem, and we apply this approach to doctrines such as divine sovereignty versus free will the kingdom of God being future versus present and election versus man's responsibility. But these seemingly contradictory doctrines may be congruent. They may be congruent in the Jewish cultural framework that gave birth to Christianity. So if you ask a Jewish man, did God choose you? Or did you choose God? 2 (41m 29s): He will likely say yes. So that's kind of a, a little bit of a backdrop for us to help us understand the complexities of some of these things that we study in our Western culture. We, we just want, we, we wanna see things kind of in a linear way. We want to one plus one equals two, one. We, we just, we want to understand it in that type of a way, but there's paradoxes in scripture. And if we don't understand that there are paradoxes in scriptures and that truth is paradoxical, then we will miss some of the deep truths that are in scripture. So sermon title, did we choose God or did God choose us? 2 (42m 13s): So we're gonna be looking at Arminianism versus Calvinism today. And so we're gonna be looking at the five points of Calvinism and kind of their counterpart, the five points of Arminianism. And we're gonna do our best to try to understand what the Bible talks about when he talking about election. When he's talking about four knowledge, when he's talking about sovereignty, when he's talking about predestination, all of these things. So the five points of Arminianism from Jacob Armen, he was a theologian who lived from 1559 to 1609. Is that better? 2 (42m 54s): Can you guys not hear me? How's that channel? Oh, there we go. Thank you. So this is my tech team over here. Thank you very much. And you guys hear me now. So the five points of arm mini and our Arminianism, the five points of Armen of Arminianism from Jacobus. Armenians are in contrast to the five points of Calvinism. So Calvinism is a theology and often we hear about Calvinism versus Arminianism and they're both they're Theo. They're, they're the theological positions that are created by theologians who have studied God's word and who just happen to come up on two different sides of an argument. 2 (43m 40s): Can we have fellowship with Calvinists as Armenians? Can we have fellowship with Armenians as Calvinists? We better be able to have fellowship because we'll be spending eternity with them forever and ever amens. So sometimes we can get a little dogmatic and say, Hey, I can't as a Calvinist, be a friend with Armenian, or I can't as an Armenian, be a friend with a Calvinist, but man, we have to all fellowship together in any given fellowship, there might be people landing on both sides of the aisle. So Calvinism is a theology. It can be explained simply using a five letter acronym tulip. And so we're gonna unpack tulip today and help us to understand just with greater clarity who God is and what it is that we understand about him. 2 (44m 28s): The set of religious principles is the work of John Calvin. Again, 1509 to 1564, a French church reformer who had a permanent influence on several branches of Protestantism. So Calvinism and Armenians both have five points, right? Let's compare the two, the Armenian five points are human free will. And we'll just take one at a time and just kind of compare the two. And then you can arrive at your own conclusion at the end of it all. And I'll introduce actually a third perspective as well today, just to muddy the waters just a little bit more for us, human free will this states that though a man is fallen. 2 (45m 12s): He is not incapacitated by the sinful nature and can freely choose God. His will is not restricted and enslaved by his sinful nature. So that's kind of, I feel like I need to get back on track here. So as we talk about that, let's understand something called common grace. The term common grace is not found in the Bible, but it's a term that is used to put a label on an aspect of grace. Like the word Trinity is not found in the Bible, but it's helpful in describing who God is. And so common grace refers to the goodness of God. The blessings that flow from God that is, that are common to all people, whether they are believers or UN believers. 2 (45m 60s): So do we understand common grace? So there's blessings and I've got a verse that help us understand it, but there's blessings in this common grace arena that fall on believers and unbelievers. So not all of God's blessings only go to God's people, but there's blessings that we all enjoy. A great example of common. Grace is Matthew 5 43 through 45. It says you have heard the law that says, love your neighbor and hate your enemy. But I say, love your enemies. Pray for those who persecute you in that way, you'll be acting as true children of your father in heaven. And here it is for, he gives sunlight to both the evil and the good, and he sends rain on the, just and on the unjust alike. 2 (46m 45s): So there's the blessings of God that flow sunlight and rain on the good and the evil, the just, and the unjust alike. The five points of Calvinism can be remembered using the acronym tulip. So T stands for total depravity. So an Armenian would say, Hey, we can choose God. We have the capacity to choose God T for the tulip stands for total depravity. It's the belief. The belief in total depravity takes the view that sinfulness pervades all areas of life and human existence through the fall of man. 2 (47m 26s): Humanity is stained by sin. In every aspect, heart emotions will mind and body. And this means that people cannot are unable to independently. Choose God. They cannot save themselves. God must intervene to save people. And as an Armenian, we would believe that that's true. Cause I tend more toward Armenian than Calvinism. So we would agree with some of the statements that Calvin makes, but we also would take issue with some of the things that he says, Calvin Calvinism insists that God must do all the work from choosing those who will be saved to sanctify, sanctifying them throughout their lives until they die and go to heaven. 2 (48m 16s): So Calvinists cite numerous scripture versus supporting humanities, fallen in simple nature. And we're gonna look at some of those. And we, we agree across the board. If you are a believer in the Lord, Jesus Christ. If you are an evangelical believer, we believe that men are sinners, all have Sinn and fall short of the glorious standard of God, the grace of God. So we, we all fall short of God's standard. Matthew 7 21 says for, from within out of a person's heart and this kind of illustrates the evil of man come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, wickedness, deceit, less full desires, envy, slander, pride, and foolishness. 2 (49m 3s): All these VI things come from within. They are what defile you. So we agree together, whether you're on whatever, whatever side of the aisle you're on. We agree that we are sinners in need of profound, the profound grace of the Lord, Jesus Christ. So again in Armenian would agree that while this is all true, man is indeed of sinner in need of God's saving grace. God's common grace and the world allow men to make good decisions. So that common grace that we experience in the world allow men and women to make good decisions. So to illustrate that we've all known people who don't know Jesus, but who are good as the world would de describe and define good. 2 (49m 48s): We know people in the world who don't know Jesus, but who are kind compassionate, faithful, generous. All of those things. We could all point to people in our lives who don't know Jesus, but who, who are really, they have a lot of good character qualities in their life. The common grace of God allows a sinful to pray person to choose God because of that common grace there's, there's a work of God in the universe that allows people to even in their broken sinful, to prove, recognize their desperate need for God and able to make a choice. Again, if you wanna look at another theological perspective, you can investigate Molan there's another, a theologian came up with this term or this perspective it's named for its 16th century, Jesuit Louis D. Molina. 2 (50m 45s): So these are arguments that the church has been or debates, arguments, debates that the church has been going around and around about for hundreds and hundreds of years. So when we get to heaven, we'll have it all straightened up for us and cleared up for us. Mullin is a system of thought that seeks you reconcile the sovereignty of God and the free will of man. The heart of Molan is the principle that God is completely sovereign. And man is also free in a libertarian incense. Molan partly seeks to avoid so-called theological determinism. The view that God decrees, who will be saved or damned without any meaningful impact of their own free choice. 2 (51m 28s): Today's highest profile defenders of Molan are William William Lane, Craig and Alvin plant GU. So if you wanna look up those guys, that would be on you. So human free will versus the total depravity of man. We would agree that man, we are totally depraved. Calvinists would say, because of that depravity, we don't have the capacity to choose God Armenian and Armenian would say, well, we believe that we're depraved, but because of the, the grace of the Lord, the common grace of God in the world where we have the capacity to choose, all right, let's take a look at conditional election versus unconditional election. 2 (52m 12s): The Armenian position, conditional election, God chose people for salvation based on his four knowledge. How many believe that God has? There's four knowledge that there's God is so four knowledge I'll just read. The definition is the awareness for knowledge is the awareness or knowledge of something before it happens or exists. My theology says that God knows everything before it happens. He doesn't need to look down to discover something, look down. He just, he understands it all before the foundation of the world. He understood and he knows all truth. 2 (52m 54s): So God has four knowledge of everything. So that, so that nothing, nothing, absolutely nothing surprises him. God knows who will respond to the gospel message. God knows. Before we are born, before we are created, God knows who will be his and who will refuse him. People are elected. They're chosen when they choose or elect God, people are chosen. So you, you wanna know if you're the elect, do you choose God? Then he chooses you. You're the elect you've been chosen by God, God knows who will choose him. So they are elected. 2 (53m 35s): God is not surprised by anything. He knows all things. It's called the omniscience of God. God is mission. He knows all things, nothing surprises him. There's nothing that he doesn't know. And anytime in history, throughout forever and ever eternity passed and eternity future, there's nothing that God doesn't know and understand a completely grasp in the tulip of Calvinism. U stands for unconditional election. The Calvinist view says, God chooses, who will be saved because people are dead in their sins. 2 (54m 15s): They are unable to initiate a response to God. In eternity, past God, elected certain people to be saved. This saved people are called the elect and God picks them based, not on their personal character or, or merit. So God chooses them not based on their personal character or merit, but out of his kindness and sovereign will. It also means that election for salvation is not based on God's fore knowledge of who would come to faith in him in the future. So Calvinists believe since some are chosen for salvation, others are not. 2 (54m 60s): So what's the opposite of salvation would be damnation. So Sal Calvinists would believe that some are chosen for salvation. Others would be chosen for damnation. Those not chosen are the damned destined for an eternity in hell. So some would argue that God is not fair. And, but that, that perspective is not fair, but I don't, I don't, I don't like the word fair. It's not a good theological word, but the word just is the word just describes the eternal character of God. He is just, he is faithful. 2 (55m 42s): And he is just so theology is the study of the nature of God. If we want to know who God is, we need to know his nature. And part of his nature is that he is just and Calvinists and Armenians both believe that God is just, we just kind of interpret things a little bit differently. First, John one nine. But if we confessed our sins to him, he is faithful. And just to forgive us, our sins and to cleanses from all wickedness. So what do we mean when we say that God is just that word has meaning and it has weight. 2 (56m 23s): And as we understand the meaning and the weight of that word, we begin to clarity. We begin to get clarity about who God is and how God functions in the world to, to, to be just means that he is perfectly righteous in his treatment of his creatures. He is perfectly righteous in his treatment of his creatures. God shows no partiality. And if you're taking notes, you can write down acts 10 34 that God shows no partiality acts 10 34. He commands against the mist treatment of others. 2 (57m 3s): Zacharia seven, 10, and he perfectly executes vengeance against the oppressor. He perfectly executes vengeance against the oppressor. Second test one six, Romans 1219 God is just in meeting out rewards, meaning God is not unjust. He will not forget your work. The love you have shown him as you have helped his people and continue to help them. Hebrews six, 10, he's equally just in meeting out punishment. Anyone who does wrong will be repaid for their wrongs. And there is no favoritism IANS, 3 25 justice and a righteousness. 2 (57m 51s): We cease from Psalm 89, 14 justice and righteousness. It's always where hand in hand are the foundation of God's thrown. So let's throw out the word fair because it's kind of Lucy goosey term. It's not a theological term. Let's use the word just is God. Just of course, God is just, he's not God. If he's not just now let's compare universal atonement with the L in tulip, which stands for limited atonement met limited atonement. Armenians believe in Armenian believes in universal atonement. 2 (58m 34s): So there's universal atonement versus limited atonement. There's gonna be a test by the way, at the end. How many, know what the tulips stands for right here? Okay. Universal. Atoma the position that Jesus bore the sin of everyone, whoever lived that's universal atonement. That's not universalism. Meaning that everybody goes to heaven. We're not talking about universalism. We're talking about universal atonement that God for God. So love the world that he gave. His only begotten son that whoever believes in him should not perish but have everlasting life. And so we're talking about universal atonement versus limited atonement, which was the Calvinist believe limited atonement is the view is the view that Jesus Christ died only for the sins of the elect. 2 (59m 24s): According to John Calvin support for this belief comes from verses that say, Jesus died for many such as Matthew, 2028, Hebrews 9 28. I'll just read those verses and you can see how someone might arrive at this position. So Christ Hebrews 9 28. So Christ having been offered once to bear the sins of many will appear a second time not to deal with sin, but to save those who are eagerly, eagerly, waiting for him. So the many there trying to understand the context, the immediate context, the wider context, and the complete context of the scripture speaks to those who give themselves to Jesus. 2 (1h 0m 10s): Those who are the saved and not everybody has given themselves to Jesus. So Christ having been offered once to bear the sins of those who have, will appear a second time, not to deal with sin, but to save those who are eagerly waiting for him, Matthew 20, 28, even as the son of man came not to be served, but to serve and to give his life as a ransom for many. So this point is one of the more controversial beliefs of Calvinism. So some, some would say, I'm not a five point Calvinist believing in all of the tulip, but I'm a four point Calvinist, which is fine in some levels. We're probably some of us might be two point Calvinist, three point. 2 (1h 0m 53s): We might be zero point it's. You know, these are things that we have to sort out. So those who teach four point Calvinism believe Christ died, not just for the, just, but not just for the elect, but for the entire world. And they cite certain verses that we know. And I just did John three 16 for God. So loved the world that he gave his only son that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. And so the atonement of God is for the world. That's 2 21, and it shall come to pass that everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved first enemy two, three, and four. This is good. And it is pleasing in the sight of God, our savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 2 (1h 1m 38s): And first John, two, two, he is the propitiation for our sins and not four hours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. So we've got these conflicting kind of ideas are, are many as Armenian people believe are they saved? Would if, if you're an Armenian, you know, holder of Armenian theology, would you say that you're saved? Yes. Okay. Would you say that if you're a Calvinist holding to Calvinist theology, would, would you say Calvinists are saved? Yeah. We're all part of the same family, right? Molan if you kind of have that moralistic perspective, would, would that person be saved? 2 (1h 2m 21s): Yeah, we're saved by grace through faith. And as we sort out these differing theological perspectives, that's why there's a thousand different churches and denominations in the world because we all have different perspectives. All right. Let's talk about resistible grace versus irresistible grace, the eye and the tulips stands for irresistible grace, resistible grace though, the teaching that the grace of God can be resisted and finally beaten. So as to reject salvation and Christ, so resistible grace versus irresistible grace irresistible grace is the belief that God brings his elect to salvation through an internal call, which they are, which they are powerless to resist the holy spirit supplies, grace to them until they repent and are born again. 2 (1h 3m 18s): So irresistible grace would say that God is so determined and extends his grace so strongly that it's ultimately irresistible. Now there's arguments within the church. Can you lose your salvation? Irresistible. Grace would say, no, you can't because the grace of God is irresistible. And even though you may backslide or fall away for a moment or a time, you will come back because of that irresistible grace, some would say, because that is true. You can't lose your salvation, but others would believe. Yeah. Yeah, you actually can fall away. Some would say, though, if you fallen away, you actually weren't saved in the first place. 2 (1h 3m 58s): So there's all kinds of, kind of gray around this idea. Can you lose your salvation? I've vacillated on this, honestly, theologically over the years, I've vacillated on this. Can you lose it? If you can. It's very hard because God is tenacious to come after us tenacious to forgive us tenacious, to love us unconditionally. So if we can lose it, it's pretty hard. It's pretty difficult, but I, I'm not gonna say you can't lose your salvation. If you walk away from God and you know, kind of bring stuff, the question was Judas saved. 2 (1h 4m 40s): I guess we'll find out when we get there. Calvin is backed this doctrine with such verses as Romans nine. And so we're just gonna go through Romans nine, 10 through 33, and we're gonna try our best to kind of unpack things in the next minute or two. And I'll just make this statement. God's for knowledge allows him or allowed him to buy a sovereign tea, direct the affairs of men, Romans nine, 10. And again, if you're a Calvinist here, or if you're Armenian, we'll have great conversation about it. 2 (1h 5m 20s): We'll find out someday. This son was our ancestor eyes kind of jumping into the middle of the chapter here. When he married Rebecca, she gave birth to twins, but before they were born, before they had done anything good or bad, she received a message from God. This message shows that God chooses people. According to his own purpose. He calls people. He calls people, but not according to their good or bad work, she was told your older son will serve your younger son. So the context of this passage, I mean, again, we look at the immediate context, the what's happening within the verses around the verse that we're trying to understand in the wider context what's happening within the book that we're studying, and then the complete context what's happening, you know, in the total story of the word of God, what is God's message to us? 2 (1h 6m 10s): So the context in this scripture seems to be talking about not a calling into salvation, but a calling into kind of position or role or responsibility. He calls people, calls people context. This calling is not talking about salvation, but not according to their good or bad works. And so this person wasn't called according to their good or bad works, but for God's purpose, God had a purpose for this person. So your older son will serve your younger son in the words of scripture. I love Jacob, but I rejected or I hated Esau. I love Jacob, but I hated Esau. 2 (1h 6m 53s): That's what the king James says. I think the original language speaks to that hatred. Why? Because Esau rejected. God, did God know that Esau was going to reject him? He did. He absolutely did. And so God, in his foreknowledge and through his sovereign, he was able to shape the events of history and the unfolding of his story history, his story, because he understood with fore knowledge, what everybody was gonna do before they were ever created. He knew. And so he was able to fashion things according to that fore knowledge and in his sovereignty unfold things, as he desired, are we saying verse 14, then that God was unfair. 2 (1h 7m 43s): Of course not for God said to Moses, I will show mercy to anyone I choose. And I will show compassion to anyone I choose. So it is God who decides to show mercy. We can either choose it. We can, we can either choose it nor work for it. Interesting. We can either choose it nor work for it. The salvation of God we is given as a free gift. It says here, we can either choose it nor work for it. So those are some difficult passages that we kind of have to wrestle through, but let's continue on here. So what is God who decides to show mercy? We can either choose it or work for it for the scripture, say that God told Pharaoh, and this is a great and interesting kind of picture. 2 (1h 8m 32s): But as we go back and read in Exodus chapter five, when Moses showed up to Farrow Farrow's response, Moses told Faroh, Hey, I'm gonna, we need to take, I need to take the Hebrew people and go worship the Lord. And Farrow said, who's the Lord that I should fear him or obey him. We get a glimpse into Pharaoh's heart, that it was already hard. It was already disobedience to the Lord. And we see as he goes on, it interacts with Moses that God gives him over to his sinfulness and uses his hard heart to further his purposes. 2 (1h 9m 18s): And so he takes his hard heart and even hardens it even more to accomplish his great purposes in the earth. But Pharaoh already had a hard heart. So God uses that to further his kingdom go back and read Exodus 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 for the scripture say that God told Pharaoh, I have appointed you for the very purpose of displaying my power in you and to spread my fame throughout the earth. So you see God chooses to show mercy to so, and he chooses to harden the hearts of others. So they refuse to listen. Now, if as a Calvinist, we believe that God can harden hearts, then that's, God can do whatever he wants to do. That's the part of the point is that if God's creed humanity, so not to diminish anything of God's power in God's sovereignty, in God's ability, he can do whatever he wants to do. 2 (1h 10m 9s): And it's just, and righteous if God's doing it, but we need to be careful not to misunderstand what God is doing and call calling something just when it's unjust or righteous. When it's unrighteous, we just need to be careful that we're understanding the totality of the word of God or the new Testament, with a clear picture of who God is, the character and the nature of God. So when we look at scripture, we need to ask ourselves a question, is this, my understanding of this scripture is it match the character and the nature of God does it match the story of the scripture? The complete message, the, the context of scripture, the immediate, the wider, the complete context. 2 (1h 10m 50s): We need to understand how to ask these questions. When we study the scripture for the scripture says that God told Faroh, I've appointed you for the very purpose of displaying my power in you and to spread my fame throughout the earth. So you see God chooses to show mercy to someone he chooses to harden the hearts of others. So they refuse to listen. So God's fore knowledge allows him to know what people will do do. And out of his fore knowledge, he acts gly in the earth. He's a just God. Well then you might say, why verse 19? Why does God blame people for not responding? Having they simply done what he makes them do? And the writer says, no, don't, don't say that. 2 (1h 11m 32s): Who are you? A mere human being to argue with God? So the thing that was created by the say to the one who created it, why have you made me like this? When a Potter makes a jar out of clay, doesn't he have a right to use the same lump of clay to make one jar for decoration and another to throw garbage in, in the same way, even though God has the right to show his anger and his power, he is very patient with those on whom his anger falls, who are destined for destruction. He does this to make the riches of his glory, shine, even brighter on those, to whom he shows mercy, we were prepared in advance for glory. 2 (1h 12m 13s): Are we among those whom he selected both from the Jews and from the Gentiles concerning the Gentiles. God says in the prophecy of those who are not my people, I will now call my people. Why weren't they as people because they're Gentiles. They're not Jews. They're not part of the chosen nation, but because they responded to the grace and the mercy of the Lord, Jesus Christ. Now they are his people. So as we think about Calvinism versus our meaning, the question for Calvinists a lot is, Hey, why do you evangelize? If it doesn't matter what we do, we're gonna be saved or not saved. And they talk about human agency. John Piper, especially talks about human agency, that God doesn't work outside of human agency. 2 (1h 12m 57s): So if people are to get saved, it's usually through the human agency of a preacher or missionary. So there's a, in my mind, it contradicts what they believe about salvation because human agency obviously is not capable in our own humanness. We're not capable of choosing, but yet God uses human agency. Those who are preaching the word of God to reach us. It for me, it's, there's a conflict there. It's hard for me to, to, to settle that kind of discrepancy or that, that confusion in my heart and mind and when we are. 2 (1h 13m 39s): And when we are among those whom he selected both from the Jews and the gen tells concerning the gen tells, we read that let's go to verse 26. And then at the place where they were told you are not my people there. They will be called children of the living God and concerning Israel. I say the prophet tried out though, the people of Israel are as numerous as the sand of the seashore. Only arrant will be saved for the Lord will carry out his sentence upon the earth quickly. And with finality. And Isaiah said the same thing in another place. If the Lord of heaven's armies had not spared a few of our children, we would've been wiped out like Sodom destroyed like Gamora. 2 (1h 14m 20s): What does all this mean? Even though the Gentiles were not trying to follow God's standard, they were made right with God. And it was by faith that this took place. How were they made? Right with God like Abraham, they were made right with God, by their faith, their own human agency. And Calvinist would say, well, God saved them outside of their own Involvement because he wanted to save them. But we know from scripture, the old and the new Testament that the righteous are justified by faith were saved by faith. 2 (1h 15m 3s): And so there's a faith element that makes people, allows people to come into the kingdom of God. They were made right with God. And it was by faith that this took place. But the people of Israel who tried so hard to get right with God, by keeping the law never succeeded, the law was a mirror put up in front of the people so that they recognize their sinfulness. It wasn't to be kept for righteousness sake. It was to be acknowledged. God is so righteous and pure and set apart that I could never measure up to him with my own good works. And so I must receive his mercy and his grace for Jews and Gentiles alike, verse 32. 2 (1h 15m 50s): I think that's where we are. Why not? Because they were trying to get right with God by keeping the law instead of by trusting in him. All right. So human, the human part of salvation is faith and trust. We, we are presented in my opinion, presented with salvation, for God's to love the world. And we have to decide, are we going to have faith? And are we going to put trust in who, in the gospel message in the person, the work of the Lord, Jesus Christ. 2 (1h 16m 34s): All right, let's skip the rest of those verses here for the sake of time. All right, finally, we get to the end of the argument. Armenians, believe a person can fall from grace. The, the P and tulip stands for the perseverance of the saints. So Calvinist would believe that even again, even if you backslide or fall away, that the perseverance of the saints will allow a person to persevere and, and walk with God all the days of their lives. Whereas a person, according to Armenian theology can fall from grace. 2 (1h 17m 17s): Let's just take a look. Calvinism teaches that the elect cannot lose their salvation because salvation is the work of God. The father, Jesus Christ, a savior in the holy spirit, it cannot be thwarted. None whom God has called will be lost. They are eternally secure, technically. However, it is God who perseveres, not the saints themselves. I don't think that bears witness with the rest of the scripture Calvin's doctrine on the perseverance of the saints is in contrast the theology of Lutheranism and the Roman Catholic church, which hold that people can lose their salvation. 2 (1h 17m 58s): Calvinist supports eternal security with versus such as John 10, 27, 28. My sheep listen to my voice. I know them and they follow me. I give them eternal life and they shall never perish. No one will snatch them out of my hand. In first Corinthians 10, 13, no temptation is overtaken. You accept what is common to mankind, and God is faithful. He will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear, but you are tempted. But when you are tempted, he will provide a way out so that you can endure it mean T private total privative man. 2 (1h 18m 38s): Good. You unconditional ion unconditional atonement. L 11 (1h 18m 45s): Limited 2 (1h 18m 46s): Limited. What limited? I wrote it down. You wrote it down. And so 12 (1h 18m 56s): Unconditional 2 (1h 18m 57s): Election, unconditional election was, yeah. You okay. Good. Unconditional election L limited atonement. I IR irresistible irresistible grace and P perseverance. Perseverance of the saints. So did God choose us or did we choose God? Yes. I think it's both. I think it's both. We choose God and God chooses us. God chooses us. And we choose God in marriage. Did I choose my wife? Or did she choose me both? Right. 2 (1h 19m 37s): Even in an arranged marriage, if you look in the old Testament, you look at some of the patriarchs. They, they had a wife chosen for them, but ultimately they were also, their wives were given the choice to them. So I chose my wife and thankfully she chose me now who chose who first? Well in this relationship, I chose her first. And then she chose me. But in relationship with God who chose, who first, what came first, the chicken or the egg, I think God chose us. And then we chose him, but we have a choice to put our faith in him and to trust him or not. 2 (1h 20m 26s): That's my perspective. Now, if you disagree, that's okay as well. I there's lots of verses. We could go and go through and read, but we're already over time by 14 minutes. And so I'm gonna invite the worship team up. I used to be grateful for the clock. Sometimes I'm not so grateful for the clock. Let's go ahead and stand up. And Lord, I, I pray that I haven't confused people more than they were in the beginning. I pray that there's at least a kind of a, an, an excitement to kind of look further into it and to kind of consider all of these things. When we're reading the scripture and trying to understand the character and the nature of God, I pray that Lord, we would just be able to think deeply about the things of God and arrive at healthy conclusions, godly conclusions that fit the context of scripture. 2 (1h 21m 20s): So Lord, help us help us, Lord, help me. Thank you, Lord, for your grace in Jesus name, let's worship. Amen. 1 (1h 21m 51s): All my words, brochure. I got nothing express as I often do with every song. Must and again, have it's except for singing. 1 (1h 23m 10s): I got one. I've got just one. We worship 0 (1h 23m 25s): You. 1 (1h 23m 28s): So, and don't don't you up? 1 (1h 24m 29s): Your, you gotta lie songs. 0 (1h 24m 37s): Praise, Lord. 1 (1h 24m 45s): Don't shy on me. Lift up your song. You gotta lie songs, get 0 (1h 24m 55s): Bad. 1 (1h 25m 6s): Your song, praise you did I 0 (1h 26m 5s): Except for hot singing hall. 13 (1h 26m 28s): Thank you Lord for your faithfulness. Thank you. That you never changed. Thank you for choosing us. 0 (1h 26m 36s): Why don't we 13 (1h 26m 39s): PHIS with your spirit, with your go with us through the rest of the week. As we proclaim you to the world around us, our friends and family and everyone we meet in Jesus name. Amen. The.